* Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

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jimlad68
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Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by jimlad68 » 02 Jun 2021 13:50

Not sure whether to put this in Plugin Discussions or General usage!

I am trying to make my Fact Notes easier to view in Ancestry.com trees.
The Export Gedcom File plugin offers: Record Note 1 NOTE: Citation Note (ANC )
This does the business, but Ancestry makes it difficult to find the Note detail.
However, although still not very well displayed (why do so many websites not honour line breaks!), it is easier to view FH Source "Text from Source" info.

So, is there a way to either:

[1] Use Export Gedcom File plugin to convert Fact Notes to the equivalent of Sources "Text from Source" linked to the Facts.

[2] Say within a project (perhaps copied for export purposes); is there a method to convert Fact Notes to Sources "Text from Source" linked (or not linked) to the Fact(s).
This procedure would also be useful to create sources on a 1 by 1 basis, although I suppose a simple copy/paste would do that.
Jim Orrell - researching: see - but probably out of date https://gw.geneanet.org/jimlad68

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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by jimlad68 » 02 Jun 2021 14:39

update - the display in Ancestry seems to differ depending on the fact:

Death Fact: A FEW MORE CLICKS ARE REqUIRED TO DISPLAY THE NOTE.
death.png
death.png (20.38 KiB) Viewed 388 times

Simple Custom Fact:
custom fact.png
custom fact.png (68.75 KiB) Viewed 388 times

Standard FH Source:
standard source.png
standard source.png (70.99 KiB) Viewed 388 times
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tatewise
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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by tatewise » 02 Jun 2021 15:00

It seems you have found the Fact Note for the Custom Fact and is shown as the Ω Note Citation Transcript.

A standard FH Source has its Text from Source moved to the Ancestry Source Note field.

If you click Edit citation and Edit source respectively then the line breaks are honoured.

The Note field text is handled the same way for all Facts, so the Note text for that Death Event must be different somehow.
What does that Death Event look like in the Facts tab of FH? Does it perhaps have an empty local Note?
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by jimlad68 » 02 Jun 2021 15:16

After some more checking of my Fact usage, Marriage is the only one I can find that displays like Death. At first I thought it might be because Death had an extra "Cause" field, but marriage does not? So I suspect it is another of the many Ancestry.com inconsistencies!
If you click Edit citation and Edit source respectively then the line breaks are honoured.
Yes, I think all of the information is there somewhere, but Ancestry do not make it easy to find or view, in so many ways! Hence my frustration and use of Geneanet trees.

It is not that important, it would take far more than this fix to make Ancestry trees easy to view "all" the info on an individual.

However, my [2] query would be very useful within FH, and as an extra step, exportable to Ancestry trees.
Jim Orrell - researching: see - but probably out of date https://gw.geneanet.org/jimlad68

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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by tatewise » 02 Jun 2021 15:25

It would be useful to me to understand what is causing the Marriage and Death event effects you have discovered.
The local Note for those events should be handled the same as any other facts.
So is there something unusual about the Notes for those two events when viewed in FH?
You may have to view those events in the All tab to see everything associated with them.

[2] I don't see how putting text into a Source Note in Ancestry is any better than a Citation Transcript.
They both need the same number of clicks to display them.
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by jimlad68 » 02 Jun 2021 15:46

OK, I do not have the Gedcom file I created for the upload to Ancestry, and I think is was from FHv6. So I will create a mini Gedcom with FHv7 to upload and report back then.

[2] As you can see from my screen prints above, the non Death+Marriage only require 1 click on the source, with Death+Marriage it is far from obvious that there is any more detail.
- We have to live with Ancestry, but I was just making the point it might be nice in FH to convert a fact text to "text from Source".

I'll report back later
Cheers
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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by tatewise » 02 Jun 2021 16:44

Don't focus on the Death & Marriage cases as I think they are abnormalities and your [2] option may not fix them.
I could not find any examples of that kind of Citation.

In the usual cases, it is only one click to show either the Ω Note Citation Transcript or the Source Note, so there is nothing to be gained with your [2] option.
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by jimlad68 » 02 Jun 2021 19:37

Mike. I created gedcoms from FHv7 using option
1. Record Note 1 NOTE: Citation Note (ANC )
2. also Record Note 1 NOTE: Keep Standard Tag (Std )

In terms of getting to view the note data I could not find any difference to my original FHv6 Gedcom.

In terms of "1st click" on the source, they were exactly as in my 2nd post.
i.e. Death+Marriage = multiple clicks, other facts and "text from source" just 1 click on source to show unformatted text (i.e. 1 long string of data).

If you really want to investigate further I can attach/send you the 3 Gedcom Files. As you mention you think "Death & Marriage cases" maybe abnormalities" (looks to me like Ancestry displays the same fields differently), so apart from those 2 the other Facts seem consistent.

I was just hoping there would be a simple fix I had not noticed.
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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by tatewise » 02 Jun 2021 19:51

Does your description of how Death & Marriage access Notes apply to every Death & Marriage event for every person?

Or is it just a particular couple of Death & Mariage events?

If just a couple then please provide screenshots of the fully expanded All tab showing those two events and subfields.

My suspicion is that there is something unusual about the fields in your Project for those Death & Marriage events.
I can see nothing different in the way my Death & Marriage events handle local Notes compared with any other facts.
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by jimlad68 » 02 Jun 2021 20:24

All of those I have checked, and to my knowledge they are all bog standard marriages+deaths.

I have specifically checked one death created via an AS Burial. The interesting thing is the other Ω Note sources (age, place) are OK with "1 click", just not the Fact Note to Ω Note Source.
death simkin.png
death simkin.png (70.93 KiB) Viewed 312 times
Also a marriage with some Note text (not from AS)
robert marriage.png
robert marriage.png (38.48 KiB) Viewed 312 times
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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by tatewise » 02 Jun 2021 21:14

I am a little concerned about the <death> and <marriage> coded text at the start of the Note text.
HTML codes all have that <code> format and Ancestry is a website that naturally uses HTML.
Do all the Death & Marriage events with a problem displaying the Ω Note Citations have similar <codes>?
Do any of your other Fact local Note text fields start with similar <codes>?
If you remove those <death> and <marriage> codes do the Ω Note Citations display the Notes correctly?

I have just uploaded Death & Marriage events with plain text Notes and they appear in Ancestry Ω Note Citations as expected.
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by jimlad68 » 02 Jun 2021 22:11

By George, I think you've got it!

After more testing, the < does not work on any fact if it is at the beginning of a line, (not tested, but I suppose it could be any text, say Place) just that I did not use it much elsewhere.
Tested both Death and Marriage without the < (I found a few) and all was consistent.

I must admit to having this problem (< at the beginning of a line) with an Android calendar app (in that case the data was lost), and when I pointed it out to the author he fixed it in the next release.

So the moral is, never use <, especially at the beginning of a line! Lots of replacing to be done.

I will add that to my list for the web, like multiple blanks are often reduced to 1.

Thanks Mike, that should enlighten us all.

[edit] P.S. without the <, it also displays more detail for a "Text from Source" (not generated by the export gedcom file) on 1 click.
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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by tatewise » 03 Jun 2021 09:15

The < > combo are reserved characters in HTML pages and used to identify bold <b>, underline <u>, and many more features. The workaround is to use less-than &lt; and greater-than &gt; escape sequences to force < and > characters to be displayed.

The Export Gedcom File plugin does already perform that conversation in some cases and I will review if it is possible to cater for them in local Fact Note text. Watch this space.
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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by jimlad68 » 03 Jun 2021 12:33

Does this need a new topic?

Mike, all interesting stuff. I'm sure your workaround would be useful down the line, but now I know; I will replace and avoid <> wherever I can, not just FH, probably with [] or () or {}, hope there is no problem with any of them!

I think "characters to avoid" has cropped up before, mostly in the light of filenames.

[1] I have found that for STRICT CLOUD and use ANYWHERE only these can be used.
@ = - ! ' $ ( ) and do not end in blank or. (i.e double full stop with ext).
(for FHUG = see below).

[2] <> as previously discussed

[3] for web text multiple spaces are often reduced to 1

[4] FHUG - if there is a " (quote) in the topic name, the "Click for Topic Link Code" cannot be accessed.
Is there a way stop Topics being created with a " in the Topic name, or the "Click" code being updated?

[5] FHUG does not accept files with = in the filename, just gives an HTTP error with no indication of the problem.
Can the error message be updated to say why, or perhaps a comment by the ADD FILES button. It took me a while to work out what was wrong, at first I thought the website had a problem.

[6] FH filters. Various and sometimes inconsistent.
- Things like Place filter for xyz will be found for ;xyz, (xyz, but not ~xyz or {xyz or [xyz.
- But, Individual filter for abc will not be found with (abc.
- generally ; seems to be a good separator in respect of filters

I suspect many web problems are bad design/programing, such as website messaging "losing the end of lines showing text as 1 long string" and not catering for <>, but being forewarned can save hassle down the line.

Anyone know anything else we should be aware of?
Jim Orrell - researching: see - but probably out of date https://gw.geneanet.org/jimlad68

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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by tatewise » 03 Jun 2021 14:19

The FHUG problems should be posted in the Web Site Usage forum.

FH filter inconsistencies could be reported to CP.

You are correct that better web design would deal with layout characters and reserved characters in text fields.
Generally, in web page HTML, all white space layout characters are ignored or reduced to a single space.
( Try putting multiple spaces in these FHUG replies. )
e.g.
newline would become the line break tag </br>
multiple-spaces could become no-break-spaces &nbsp;
< and > should become &lt; and &gt; automatically
Google search for HTML reserved characters for the others " ' &
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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Re: Convert Fact Note to linked Text from Source

Post by ColeValleyGirl » 03 Jun 2021 14:42

jimlad68 wrote:
03 Jun 2021 12:33
[4] FHUG - if there is a " (quote) in the topic name, the "Click for Topic Link Code" cannot be accessed.
Is there a way stop Topics being created with a " in the Topic name, or the "Click" code being updated?

Nope; sorry. We're dependent on what the platform we use supports, and neither of the admins have the time to rewrite the platform.

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