In uploading my gedcom to PGV I found that I still had some Places (PLAC) with the wrong hierarchy, despite recently correcting them all.
I have used PSPad Editor to review my Gedcom file and can see that in all the cases where there is a incorrect Place data it is associated with a Residence (RESI) attribute. Furthermore, when I look for the source in Family Historian it is not there. That is, the source ID in question does not exist in the Source window.
This is how they appear in PSPad. Note that the SOUR reference has @@ on either side, whereas other Source IDs (which appear as correctly in FH) only have @ on either side.
1 RESI
2 DATE 7 JAN 1905
2 PLAC Reginald St, Derby
2 SOUR @@S83@@
The attributes (Residence) that these sources relate to don't appear in the relevant people's records as Facts. So is FH suppressing this data for some reason? How do I prevent this? If I can't, how do I edit the source record so I can see the Place entry in FH and correct it?
Thanks
ID:4947
* Hidden Sources - where / why have they gone?
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tatewise
- Megastar
- Posts: 28410
- Joined: 25 May 2010 11:00
- Family Historian: V7
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- Contact:
Hidden Sources - where / why have they gone?
I have more questions than answers.
Firstly, if I use PSPad to edit a .ged file and change a Residence 2 SOUR @S83@ tag to 2 SOUR @@S83@@ then it displays OK in the Events/Facts tab of FH 3.0.1/4.1.3, but the Source pane shows the @S83@ reference but cannot open the Source.
Have you any clues as to how the .ged got upset?
What tags are on the lines following 2 SOUR @@S83@@?
Does a Source Record with Record Id = 83 exist?
Which version of FH are you using?
Have you tried the File > Validate command?
Have you tried File > Backup/Restore > Restore and restored an old .ged file to a folder outside your project and examined its contents?
Firstly, if I use PSPad to edit a .ged file and change a Residence 2 SOUR @S83@ tag to 2 SOUR @@S83@@ then it displays OK in the Events/Facts tab of FH 3.0.1/4.1.3, but the Source pane shows the @S83@ reference but cannot open the Source.
Have you any clues as to how the .ged got upset?
What tags are on the lines following 2 SOUR @@S83@@?
Does a Source Record with Record Id = 83 exist?
Which version of FH are you using?
Have you tried the File > Validate command?
Have you tried File > Backup/Restore > Restore and restored an old .ged file to a folder outside your project and examined its contents?
-
PeterR
- Megastar
- Posts: 1135
- Joined: 10 Jul 2006 16:55
- Family Historian: V7
- Location: Northumberland, UK
Hidden Sources - where / why have they gone?
Please note that a GEDCOM file entry such as 2 SOUR @@S83@@ is displayed in FH as a Source Note rather than as a link to a Source Record.
I have other questions:
Is the Residence attribute visible in the Records window or the Property Box All tab for the relevant individual?
Is it possible to locate the missing Residence field by using Find Record (or Ctrl+F) and searching for Reginald St, Derby in All Record Types, looking in All text fields?
I have other questions:
Is the Residence attribute visible in the Records window or the Property Box All tab for the relevant individual?
Is it possible to locate the missing Residence field by using Find Record (or Ctrl+F) and searching for Reginald St, Derby in All Record Types, looking in All text fields?
Hidden Sources - where / why have they gone?
Thanks to both for your quick responses. Here are my attempts to answer your questions. I think the answer lies in my response to Peter's final question - see below, but for completeness I have answered all the questions.
Have you any clues as to how the .ged got upset?
A - No, although not sure it is - see below
What tags are on the lines following 2 SOUR @@S83@@?
A - I have just noticed that @@83@@ occurs twice in the gedcom. this is what is immediately below the entry I referred to in my first post.
3 QUAY 3
1 CHAN
2 DATE 9 JAN 2011
3 TIME 09:37:00
The other occurrence is also associated with incorrect PLAC data which I can't see in FH.
1 RESI
2 DATE 7 JAN 1905
2 PLAC Chellaston
2 SOUR @@S83@@
3 QUAY 3
0 @F307@ FAM
1 MARR
2 DATE 29 AUG 1883
2 PLAC , , Derby, Derbyshire, England
2 ADDR , Saint Andrews
Does a Source Record with Record Id = 83 exist?
A - Not in the Source Window - it skips from 82 to 84 - but see answers to Peter's questions below.
Which version of FH are you using?
A - 4.1.3
Have you tried the File > Validate command?
A - Yes, no errors found
Have you tried File > Backup/Restore > Restore and restored an old .ged file to a folder outside your project and examined its contents?
A - not exactly, but I have opened an old backup from Nov 2009 and this Source record is also missing from there too. That was probably created using an older version of FH.
Peter R - you said 'Please note that a GEDCOM file entry such as 2 SOUR @@S83@@ is displayed in FH as a Source Note rather than as a link to a Source Record.'
Q - so how do I access the record to edit it?
Is the Residence attribute visible in the Records window or the Property Box All tab for the relevant individual?
A - I have added the Residence column to the Records window, but there is no entry against the relevant records. Also there is no mention of the Residence attribute in the Property Box All tab.
Is it possible to locate the missing Residence field by using Find Record (or Ctrl+F) and searching for Reginald St, Derby in All Record Types, looking in All text fields?
A - OK, I think this is a good lead. I followed your instructions and it found a record in the Families View which contains the following
RESI
- DATE
- PLAC Reginald St, Derby
- SOUR @83@
Should I just delete this data in this window, and then create a new Residence Attribute for the records in question? BTW - I did the same search on several of my other anomalies and they are all appended to Family records in the same way as this one, so this does seem to be the key. I just need to know now how best to fix it. Suggestions very welcome!
Thanks again
Have you any clues as to how the .ged got upset?
A - No, although not sure it is - see below
What tags are on the lines following 2 SOUR @@S83@@?
A - I have just noticed that @@83@@ occurs twice in the gedcom. this is what is immediately below the entry I referred to in my first post.
3 QUAY 3
1 CHAN
2 DATE 9 JAN 2011
3 TIME 09:37:00
The other occurrence is also associated with incorrect PLAC data which I can't see in FH.
1 RESI
2 DATE 7 JAN 1905
2 PLAC Chellaston
2 SOUR @@S83@@
3 QUAY 3
0 @F307@ FAM
1 MARR
2 DATE 29 AUG 1883
2 PLAC , , Derby, Derbyshire, England
2 ADDR , Saint Andrews
Does a Source Record with Record Id = 83 exist?
A - Not in the Source Window - it skips from 82 to 84 - but see answers to Peter's questions below.
Which version of FH are you using?
A - 4.1.3
Have you tried the File > Validate command?
A - Yes, no errors found
Have you tried File > Backup/Restore > Restore and restored an old .ged file to a folder outside your project and examined its contents?
A - not exactly, but I have opened an old backup from Nov 2009 and this Source record is also missing from there too. That was probably created using an older version of FH.
Peter R - you said 'Please note that a GEDCOM file entry such as 2 SOUR @@S83@@ is displayed in FH as a Source Note rather than as a link to a Source Record.'
Q - so how do I access the record to edit it?
Is the Residence attribute visible in the Records window or the Property Box All tab for the relevant individual?
A - I have added the Residence column to the Records window, but there is no entry against the relevant records. Also there is no mention of the Residence attribute in the Property Box All tab.
Is it possible to locate the missing Residence field by using Find Record (or Ctrl+F) and searching for Reginald St, Derby in All Record Types, looking in All text fields?
A - OK, I think this is a good lead. I followed your instructions and it found a record in the Families View which contains the following
RESI
- DATE
- PLAC Reginald St, Derby
- SOUR @83@
Should I just delete this data in this window, and then create a new Residence Attribute for the records in question? BTW - I did the same search on several of my other anomalies and they are all appended to Family records in the same way as this one, so this does seem to be the key. I just need to know now how best to fix it. Suggestions very welcome!
Thanks again
-
tatewise
- Megastar
- Posts: 28410
- Joined: 25 May 2010 11:00
- Family Historian: V7
- Location: Torbay, Devon, UK
- Contact:
Hidden Sources - where / why have they gone?
It looks like you may have solved the problem.
Please use PSPad to examine the .ged file and locate the problem 1 RESI tags.
Search up from these tags to the first tag with 0 as the first character.
Is this a 0 @F99@ FAM Family Record tag rather than a 0 @I99@ INDI Individual Record tag?
If so then these 1 RESI tags should be seen in the All tab of the appropriate Family Property Box or by expanding the Family Record in the Family Records window.
The @F99@ number identifies the Family Record Id.
Strangely, although 1 RESI tags (I believe) are not allowed in Family records the File > Validate option finds no error.
To correct the problem tags you need to move the whole RESI structure to one or both Individual Records associated with the Family Record.
Alternatively, make a note of the details , delete the RESI structures in FH All tab, and re-enter the Facts from scratch.
I cannot explain how this upset could have happened.
Please use PSPad to examine the .ged file and locate the problem 1 RESI tags.
Search up from these tags to the first tag with 0 as the first character.
Is this a 0 @F99@ FAM Family Record tag rather than a 0 @I99@ INDI Individual Record tag?
If so then these 1 RESI tags should be seen in the All tab of the appropriate Family Property Box or by expanding the Family Record in the Family Records window.
The @F99@ number identifies the Family Record Id.
Strangely, although 1 RESI tags (I believe) are not allowed in Family records the File > Validate option finds no error.
To correct the problem tags you need to move the whole RESI structure to one or both Individual Records associated with the Family Record.
Alternatively, make a note of the details , delete the RESI structures in FH All tab, and re-enter the Facts from scratch.
I cannot explain how this upset could have happened.
-
PeterR
- Megastar
- Posts: 1135
- Joined: 10 Jul 2006 16:55
- Family Historian: V7
- Location: Northumberland, UK
Hidden Sources - where / why have they gone?
I suspected that the RESI field may have been linked to a Family rather than an Individual.
The RESI tag for a Residence attribute is valid only when linked to an Individual. There is no standard GEDCOM tag for Residence linked to a Family. If you double-click on the Family record that you found to contain the missing residence data, you may see something like the following:
The 'star-burst' around the red dot indicates the use of an invalid GEDCOM tag which FH treats as 'Uncategorised Data Field' (UDF). There is a standard Named List which facilitates finding such records and a Tools menu item Find Uncategorized Data....
You can define a custom attribute e.g. 'Co-residence' for the Family; this would display properly in the Family Facts tab and record window. The corresonding GEDCOM file entry would then be:
1 _ATTR
2 TYPE Co-residence
2 DATE FROM SEP 1982 TO 4 JUL 2007
2 PLAC Surrey
You could use PSPad to edit your GEDCOM file to correct the invalid RESI tags linked to Family records, but you would probably have to find them individually.
Since there is currently no Source record with ID 83, there is no way to find it and edit it. You can of course create a link to an existing Source record or to a new Source record in the usual way, but it probably wouldn't have ID 83, and that wouldn't matter.
The RESI tag for a Residence attribute is valid only when linked to an Individual. There is no standard GEDCOM tag for Residence linked to a Family. If you double-click on the Family record that you found to contain the missing residence data, you may see something like the following:
The 'star-burst' around the red dot indicates the use of an invalid GEDCOM tag which FH treats as 'Uncategorised Data Field' (UDF). There is a standard Named List which facilitates finding such records and a Tools menu item Find Uncategorized Data....
You can define a custom attribute e.g. 'Co-residence' for the Family; this would display properly in the Family Facts tab and record window. The corresonding GEDCOM file entry would then be:
1 _ATTR
2 TYPE Co-residence
2 DATE FROM SEP 1982 TO 4 JUL 2007
2 PLAC Surrey
You could use PSPad to edit your GEDCOM file to correct the invalid RESI tags linked to Family records, but you would probably have to find them individually.
Since there is currently no Source record with ID 83, there is no way to find it and edit it. You can of course create a link to an existing Source record or to a new Source record in the usual way, but it probably wouldn't have ID 83, and that wouldn't matter.
Hidden Sources - where / why have they gone?
Brilliant! Thank you both very much. I now have a Named List showing me exactly which records (4 Individual and 9 Family) where I have errors that need correcting. I really appreciate the detailed and swift (and accurate!) responses.
For the record, I think this situation arose because (for a short while at least, and a long time ago) I thought it would be a good idea to share address details across a Family rather than adding them one by one to to each individual. Seemed like a good idea at the time...
One final question - I think I can fairly easily find these entries via PSPad. Do I then simply delete the following rows (as an example) (after copying them into new RESI Attributes for the relevant individuals of course), save the file in PSPad and reopen it via FH?
1 RESI
2 DATE 1901
2 PLAC 1 Hill Grove, Wellington Rd, Handsworth
2 SOUR @@S63@@
3 PAGE RG 13/2712 page 17 (13)
Thanks again
Eric
For the record, I think this situation arose because (for a short while at least, and a long time ago) I thought it would be a good idea to share address details across a Family rather than adding them one by one to to each individual. Seemed like a good idea at the time...
One final question - I think I can fairly easily find these entries via PSPad. Do I then simply delete the following rows (as an example) (after copying them into new RESI Attributes for the relevant individuals of course), save the file in PSPad and reopen it via FH?
1 RESI
2 DATE 1901
2 PLAC 1 Hill Grove, Wellington Rd, Handsworth
2 SOUR @@S63@@
3 PAGE RG 13/2712 page 17 (13)
Thanks again
Eric
-
tatewise
- Megastar
- Posts: 28410
- Joined: 25 May 2010 11:00
- Family Historian: V7
- Location: Torbay, Devon, UK
- Contact:
Hidden Sources - where / why have they gone?
Essentially yes, if you edit using PSPad, but see my later suggestion.
You delete from the 1 RESI tag up to but not including the next tag line starting with 1 or 0.
However, Source ref @@S63@@ is not valid, and should not be copied.
Now you know the records involved, and there are only a small number, it is probably safer to do all the editing in FH.
Armed with the RESI tag details, create the Individual Residence Facts from scratch.
Locate the faulty records and delete the RESI tags via the All tab, or by expanding the record in the Records Window.
You delete from the 1 RESI tag up to but not including the next tag line starting with 1 or 0.
However, Source ref @@S63@@ is not valid, and should not be copied.
Now you know the records involved, and there are only a small number, it is probably safer to do all the editing in FH.
Armed with the RESI tag details, create the Individual Residence Facts from scratch.
Locate the faulty records and delete the RESI tags via the All tab, or by expanding the record in the Records Window.
Hidden Sources - where / why have they gone?
All sorted now. Thanks to you two I have not only cleared up the errors I had spotted, but I have fixed some others that were not so obvious. And I have a better understanding of how to use some of the features of FH
Thanks again
Eric
Thanks again
Eric