* Importing from TMG death of a baby

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Linda Reinfeld
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Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by Linda Reinfeld » 20 Nov 2021 22:24

I am using TMG9 & FH 7.0.8

I have a normal death tag that imports to FH with an age in years - it is fine.
In TMG I have a death tag called DeathBaby, which calculates age in months and days. I use it for those who died before 1 year.

I realize FH doesn't have a fact of DeathBaby, but when I change that fact to be death, the age is '0'. That looks terrible.
If I leave the fact at DeathBaby no year of death is shown for lifespan.

How do people in FH deal with children who died before the age of 1? I do not want to have the age in months, days, years, calculated for everyone.

Linda S Reinfeld

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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by jbtapscott » 20 Nov 2021 23:31

Perhaps I'm missing the point here, but where I have a child who died under the age of one I enter the Months / days (as appropriate) in the Age field on the Death fact, or select "Infant" or, for one one sad case, "Stillborn"
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Linda Reinfeld
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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by Linda Reinfeld » 21 Nov 2021 00:41

I have 394 DeathBaby facts. Too many to manually calculate the age at death.

However, you gave me an idea. I also have DeathInfant tag, when I have no idea how old the child was. I shall give them a regular death tag and add 'as an infant' in the notes.

Thanks, Linda

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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by tatewise » 21 Nov 2021 11:56

Linda, does the DeathBaby fact imported from TMG into FH have the age at death as its descriptive value?
As long as they follow a consistent format, I would be happy to write a Plugin to convert them to standard Death events with Age in months and days.
If you are interested then please post some examples of the format that DeathBaby uses.
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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by ColeValleyGirl » 21 Nov 2021 12:06

Linda Reinfeld wrote:
21 Nov 2021 00:41
However, you gave me an idea. I also have DeathInfant tag, when I have no idea how old the child was. I shall give them a regular death tag and add 'as an infant' in the notes.
'Infant' (entered as an age via the Age Data Entry Assistant) specifically means less than a year; Child means less than 8.

For your DeathInfant tag (converted to a regular Death tag) you might want to use something less confusing in the Note. Perhaps 'Died before adulthood'?

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Linda Reinfeld
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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by Linda Reinfeld » 21 Nov 2021 20:10

Mike -

TMG does not have an 'age' field in the death tag (or in any other tag). It's much easier for the computer to calculate the age. Therefore I changed the FH standard death tag to calculate the age, which shows up in years - I am happy with that. Under 1 year old the age is 0. I am not happy with that. I really don't see how I can use a standard death event to calculate age for some people and not calculate age for other people. I believe FH can have only 1 death event, so I can't create 2 death events. Thank you for the offer, though

Helen -

My 'Infant' works well with FH definition of Infant - under 1 year. However my FH death event calculates the age at death and thereford Infant won't work in the death date. I shall use notes - which means I will not have a lifespan for them.

Thank you for the ideas - Linda

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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by tatewise » 21 Nov 2021 22:05

When you say you let FH calculate the Death Age, do you mean the Age in brackets in the upper pane on the Facts tab?
That is an estimated Age derived from the Birth Event Date and the Death Event Date.

In FH when say a Death Certificate gives the Age at Death then that can be entered in the Death Event Age field.
That specific Age (Years, Months, Days) will then appear in the Facts tab upper pane without brackets.

If your infant deaths have accurate Birth Event Dates and Death Event Dates then I can provide a Plugin that calculates the age at death in Months and Days (just like TMG) and fills that into the Death Event Age field. It would only do that for deaths earlier than 1 year or whatever limit you choose. Are you interested?

BTW: FH can have as many Birth &/or Death events as you like, although not relevant here.
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Linda Reinfeld
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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by Linda Reinfeld » 22 Nov 2021 00:31

Mike -

My Death fact is: {individual} died {date} {place} <{note}> <at age {%FACT.DATE:AGE_AT%}>
which produces the sentence: He died on 24 March 1885 in Crawford County,Pennsylvania at age 72.
The sentence is what I am interested in - for reports and an online system.

If you write the plugin to create an age (months, days) how would that work with my death fact? I don't think it would. For the plugin to work I would have to use the standard death fact, which would not give an age to the rest of the people in my project. And if I had another plugin to calculate age of everyone else, it would seem to me I would either have to run the plugins every day, or calculate the age of most everyone.

In FH when you want a death age do you always have to calculate it yourself and enter it in? I think the same question would apply for marriage, whatever else is important.

A related question - my deathbaby event right now is a 'fact'. I don't think it is a death in the eyes of Gedcom or FH. In TMG we had a living flag Y or N (or ?). How does FH decide someone is living? Only with a Gedcom Death fact?

(Sorry about the terminology - I am trying to use the correct terms, but as they are different I forget sometimes).

Thanks for the help

Linda

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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by tatewise » 22 Nov 2021 11:27

Thank you for explaining how you have adjusted the Death event to show calculated ages.

The Death Sentence Template can be tweaked to cope with explicit and estimated ages.
Replace the <at age {%FACT.DATE:AGE_AT%}> code with this:
{age}<at age {=TextIf( Exists(%FACT.AGE%), , %FACT.DATE:AGE_AT%)}>

The {age} code copes with any Death Event that has an actual Age recorded.
{%FACT.DATE:AGE_AT%} is replaced with {=TextIf( Exists(%FACT.AGE%), , %FACT.DATE:AGE_AT% )}.
That tests if %FACT.AGE% exists and if so yields nothing, otherwise it yields the calculated age as before.

Thus the Plugin I propose would only be run once to set the actual Age in Months and Days for infant deaths.

Users do not usually calculate fact Ages. They are derived from source documents such as Death and Marriage Certificates and as such may not agree with the calculated age derived from the Birth Event. It is a value judgement which to trust.

By default, FH does have a Living Flag and also a Private Flag, and you can add as many custom Flags as you like.
In FH, as well as testing the Living Flag, it is possible to test the existence of a Death, Burial, or Cremation Event similar to the way Fact Age is tested above.
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Linda Reinfeld
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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by Linda Reinfeld » 22 Nov 2021 14:44

Mike -

Thanks for the code. It is excellent for 2 of my 3 death dates problems! It gives the date in years for everyone, and if I enter the age as Infant (using age entry assistant) it doesn't say 'age 0'. Excellent.

The problem seems still to be with DeathBaby. If you run the plugin I understand the age field will be updated for months, days, and will fix all my current data. However, if I enter a new death the age will still come back as 0.

If needs be, I don't mind having a seperate death fact for the dates less than a year, because most of my problem has been solved. I just really don't like age 0. Or I could just identify those people as infant. It just seems as though death at 1 day is different than death at 9 months.

Thank you very much.

Linda

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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by tatewise » 22 Nov 2021 15:26

You can keep the Plugin for as long as you like. Then run it on those relatively rare occasions when you enter the Death of an infant whose age in months and days is not given on the Death Certificate. The Plugin will be intelligent enough to only update Death Events without an Age value and only for infant deaths. In addition to calculating age based on the Birth Date of the child, it could use the first Baptism Date or Christening Date where there is no Birth Event date.

Are you interested?
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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by Linda Reinfeld » 22 Nov 2021 15:46

Yes, Mike, that sounds good.

Thank you -

Linda

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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by tatewise » 22 Nov 2021 22:39

I have a prototype Plugin working on some test cases, but just need to check a few details before I let you try it.

Do you only want Infant Death Ages calculated when the following conditions are true:
  1. There is a Birth or Baptism or Christening event with a single simple unqualified full Date.
    i.e. The Date has a Day and Month and Year but no circa, approx, calculated, estimated, before, after qualifiers.
  2. There is a Death event with a single simple unqualified full Date as above.
  3. The difference between those two event Dates is from 0 to 365 days.
  4. There is no Death Age already recorded.
  5. The two Dates do NOT span the Julian - Gregorian switchover days in Oct 1582 or Sep 1752.
  6. The two Dates do NOT use 'double dating' relevant to that switchover.
If those last two conditions are important for you then they could probably be catered for but the logic is a bit complex.

If any of the other conditions do not suit you then please let me know.
e.g. Do you want more flexibility in the event Dates?
If you want to allow the Day of the month to be missing from a Date what number do you want to substitute?
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Linda Reinfeld
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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by Linda Reinfeld » 23 Nov 2021 01:06

Hi Mike -

I just checked my data - I am missing 7 death dates - Bad Data, I will fix those records. And a few have no day. I will also fix those. All other records have a full date.

It will be either a birth or baptism. I did a small sample - 30 out of 295, none had a qualifier. If they do, just identify the record in error.

All other conditions are fine. The only thing is, could you identify - probably by ID - any record that you don't change. I can then go and change it myself. As far as I can see, any record that doesn't meet the criteria you have outlined is in error.

Just want to make it as simple as possible....

Thanks - Linda

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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by tatewise » 23 Nov 2021 14:31

The attached Update Age of Infant Deaths plugin Version 0.1 Date 23 Nov 2021 should do what you requested.
Click on the blue link to download and install the plugin, then run it via the Tools > Plugins... window.

It now copes with the Julian-Gregorian switchover days and associated year 'double dates'.

If after running the plugin, anything looks wrong, then note the problems and use the Edit > Undo Plugin Updates command to revert all Ages to their status before running the plugin.

The displayed Result Set lists all the infant Deaths detected where no Death Age is already recorded,
i.e. The difference between the Birth/Baptism Date and Death Date in any format is from 0 to 365 days.

Where the Death Age is updated it is shown, otherwise when either Date is unsuitable the Death Age is left blank.
Click on the Death Age column heading to sort into order with the blank ones at the top.

Note that the counts of Ages updated and Ages not set are shown on the top window border.
Attachments
Update Age of Infant Deaths.fh_lua
Version 0.1 Date 23 Nov 2021
(16.12 KiB) Downloaded 1 time
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Linda Reinfeld
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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by Linda Reinfeld » 23 Nov 2021 22:05

Hi Mike -

It works great. I didn't realize I had so many 'non-conforming' deaths. And then I realized they were all from my TMG event DeathInfant. I changed those to death in TMG and put 'as an infant' in the memo field in TMG. I will go through my data and figure that out. But in the future, when I enter data in FH, I will use the data assistant to add infant, which works well in FH.

I tested that also - I added someone in FH with death 'infant' and your plugin didn't report on them. So that is also good.

Thanks for all the help. Both in the plug-in and in the death sentence structure.

Linda

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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by tatewise » 23 Nov 2021 22:26

I'm glad that worked out Ok.

If you have too many of the Death 'as an infant' in the memo cases to correct by hand then the Plugin could be adjusted to detect the 'as an infant' memo and automatically set the Death Age to Infant and delete the memo.
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Linda Reinfeld
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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by Linda Reinfeld » 23 Nov 2021 22:44

Mike -

I have 220 to fix. For the plug-in to detect 'as an infant' in the note field and then set the death age to Infant & then delete the note - Wow, perfect.

I would do it myself, except that there is no way to export 'as an infant' to the death age field which means I would have to post-process, and I am hoping not to have to do that.

Thanks again -

Linda

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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by tatewise » 24 Nov 2021 10:13

Try the attached Update Age of Infant Deaths plugin Version 0.2 Date 24 Nov 2021 that should handle those infant cases.

As I said before, keep the Plugin, so that in future after entering the Birth and Death dates for an infant, you can run it to calculate and set the Death Age in months and days.
Attachments
Update Age of Infant Deaths.fh_lua
Version 0.2 Date 24 Nov 2021
(16.71 KiB) Downloaded 3 times
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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Linda Reinfeld
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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by Linda Reinfeld » 24 Nov 2021 15:44

Mike -

Looks great. The exception report is something I can deal with on an individual basis.

You said - keep the plugin. When I downloaded & ran it it ended up in the folder: I have Win10
windows/Program Data/Calico Pie/Family Historian/Plugins.

Is that the correct place to 'keep' it? Can I transfer it to my FH folder and 'keep' it there?
(Sorry to ask such a basic question)

Linda

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Re: Importing from TMG death of a baby

Post by tatewise » 24 Nov 2021 16:42

Like the majority of 'custom settings', Plugins are held in the C:\ProgramData\Calico Pie\Family Historian\... folder.
That makes them available to all Projects. See the Knowledge Base Family Historian Program Data Folder.

Therefore, one thing to remember is those 'custom settings' are NOT included in Project database Backups.
There is a Backup and Restore Family Historian Settings Plugin that does backup those 'custom settings'.
See the Knowledge Base Backup and Recovery for further details.

The above topics are covered in the Knowledge Base Key Features for Newcomers that I believe you should have been advised to study when you joined the FHUG, or am I mistaken?
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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