* Details missing from named list

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johnhanson
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Details missing from named list

Post by johnhanson » 11 May 2022 17:33

Still trying to tidy up my database after the import from TMG
I created a named list comtining all those with a divorce entry
I then added the columns for divorce date and divorce place
However the columns are blank for everyone - see attached image
I have tried removing the entry for the person on the image and adding it again incase of an issue with the import but it still does not show
Any ideas?
Regards
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FH-Named-list-divorce.jpg
FH-Named-list-divorce.jpg (190.24 KiB) Viewed 831 times
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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by tatewise » 11 May 2022 17:59

John, with these types of enquiry, it is helpful to provide as many details as possible.
In this case, what Expressions did you use for the Divorce Date and Divorce Place columns?
They would have to be along the lines of %INDI.FAMS[1]>DIV.DATE% and %INDI.FAMS[1]>DIV.PLAC%
i.e. The Family as Spouse (FAMS) link must be used to reach the Family record where Divorce events are held.
However, that only works for the 1st Partnership FAMS[1] and not later partnerships FAMS[2] and FAMS[3].
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by johnhanson » 11 May 2022 22:16

Mike
I simply clicked on the list that comes up when you click on the configure columns!
Which would then give I assume the details from Calico Pie as it is part of the standard set
for the date that is - %FAM.DIV[1].DATE:YEAR%FAM.DIV.DATE:ABBREV2
for the place it is - FAM.DIV.PLAC
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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by LornaCraig » 11 May 2022 23:02

John, when I click on the list that comes up when you click on the configure columns I get:
INDI.FAMS[1]>DIV.DATE:ABBREV2 and INDI.FAMS[1]>DIV.PLAC which both work.
Lorna

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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by tatewise » 11 May 2022 23:21

When you say you clicked on the list that comes up, what was the Record Type chosen top left?
Since your Records are clearly Individuals, I would expect Record Type: Individual.
In that case, Divorce Date produces the Expression: INDI.FAMS[1]>DIV.DATE:ABBREV2
Similarly, Divorce Place produces the Expression: INDI.FAMS[1]>DIV.PLAC
Those are essentially what I've said you need.

To get an Expression: like FAM.DIV[1].DATE or FAM.DIV.PLAC would need Record Type: Family that does not match the type of record in your list.

The problem is that, unlike the Records Window tabs, a Named List can contain any combination of record types all in the same list, so potentially any data reference could be valid, but will only work with the appropriate record type.
As an experiment, add the Family record ...of John Black WALLACE and Noni COLLINSON-SMITH and I suspect the Divorce columns will get populated for that row.
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by johnhanson » 12 May 2022 15:15

Sorry for the delay but lifes a little hectic at present
I have been doing some testing and I still belive that the defaul text reference is incorrect
I created a query to re-extract all of the divorce records using the
Family/events/divorce field not being empty and extracted the "family as spouse husband" and "family as spouse wife"
I also added the fields for the date and place of the divorce to the query so that I could check that they are correct
I created a new named list from this result for the divorced people
(Whilst the exact details of all of the people is not known their is enough evidence in the 1939 register to know that there was a divorce)
I added to the new named list the columns for family/event/divorce date and place
Again all the fields are empty
I then went back into the "configure columns" for the list and used the "insert data reference" and re-directed them as follows
For date the default reference is "FAM.DIV.DATE:ABBREV2" and changed to "%INDI.FAMS[1]>DIV[1].DATE:YEAR%%INDI.FAMS[1]>DIV[1].DATE:YEAR%"
For date it changes from "FAM.DIV.PLAC" to "%INDI.FAMS[1]>DIV[1].PLAC:SHORT%FAM.DIV.PLAC"
All then displays as it should
So the default references are incorrect to my mind
I did wonder if it was to do with the way that I set things in TMG and the import into FH
However I checked against another tree which has never been near TMG and got the same results
Happy to let you have copies of anything you may require
Regards
John Hanson
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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by tatewise » 12 May 2022 15:35

John, the form of the data reference depends crucially on which type of record you start from.
Let me give some examples...

1) Starting from an Individual record all data references MUST start with INDI.
So to reach a spouse Family record where Divorce events are held you must use:
%INDI.FAMS[1]>DIV% and to that you add .DATE or .PLAC to reach Date or Place subfields.
Similarly to reach a Source record Text From Source field you must use:
%INDI.SOUR[1]>TEXT%

2) Starting from a Family record all data references MUST start with FAM.
So to reach a Family record Divorce event you MUST use:
%FAM.DIV% and to that you add .DATE or .PLAC to reach Date or Place subfields.

3) Starting from a Source record all data references MUST start with SOUR.
So to reach a Source record Text From Source field you must use:
%SOUR.TEXT%

4) The same rule applies to all 12 types of records: Note (NOTE), Repository (REPO), Media (OBJE), Place (_PLAC), etc.
The data reference is different depending on which type of record it relates to.

It sounds like your experiment involved a Family record type of Query so case 2) above applies.
But your Named List holds Individual records so case 1) above applies.
That explains why %FAM.DIV...% does not work and %INDI.FAMS[1]>DIV...% does work.

When configuring your Named List Columns what was the Record Type chosen top left?
That determines whether case 1) or 2) or 3) or 4) above is applied to the data reference Items list and after adding <Other...> also applies to the << Insert Data Ref... feature which in your Named List of Individual records must start with Individual.
It can get confusingly misleading in a Named List because they can hold any mixture of record types, so every type of record must be catered for, unlike Record Window tabs or Queries where only one type of starting record is allowed.

It would be interesting to see a screenshot of the data references in your Query experiment.
It would also be crucial to see if the Result Set displayed what you expected.
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by LornaCraig » 12 May 2022 16:56

John,
In case it helps here is a screenshot of the Configure Columns for Named List showing the options I used. This produces INDI.FAMS[1]>DIV.DATE:ABBREV2 and INDI.FAMS[1]>DIV.PLAC which Mike and I have both mentioned.

configure columns.JPG
configure columns.JPG (71.47 KiB) Viewed 698 times
Lorna

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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by johnhanson » 13 May 2022 09:18

Lorna
Thanks for that but I well aware of which one to select

Mike
Thanks for the details and all makes sense now
image of query columns attached
only one filter - exclude if "%INDI.FAMS[1]>DIV[1]%" is null
image of result attached
So the question is how to add the details of the families rather than individuals to the named list
I am simply trying to create a list of all those people that had a divorce so that I can check them
Regards
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NL-Result.jpg
NL-Result.jpg (165.11 KiB) Viewed 650 times
NL-columns.jpg
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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by tatewise » 13 May 2022 10:02

I imagine you are well aware that in the Facts tab blue bullets indicate Individual facts and red bullets indicate Family facts.
If you were interested in Birth or Death, which are Individual events, then focusing on Individual records is best.
But you are interested in Divorce, which is a Family event, so you should focus on Family records instead of Individuals.

I suggest you start in the Records Window on the Families tab.
(If there is no Families tab, then use Tools > Preferences > Records Window and under Record Type Display Options set every option to Always show to enable every tab.)

Configure the Families tab Columns to include the Divorce Date selected from the lefthand Items.
Then click Edit... and change the Heading to Divorce and the Expression to just FAM.DIV and sort Descending.
(That is similar to your Query but with data reference FAM.DIV as it is focussed on Family records.)
Click OK twice to close the Configure Columns... dialogue.
Click that new Divorce column heading to bring all Family records with a Divorce to the top of the Records Window.

In terms of having a list to investigate that may be sufficient for your purposes.
However, those Family records can be selected and added to a Named List in the same way as you add Individual records.
In the Named List configure the columns to show the FAM.DIV divorce details in the same way as above.

In either the Records Window or Named List configure the Columns to show the husband & wife Individuals.
i.e. Add an <Other...> item and use << Insert Data Ref... to obtain the Husband Individual record data reference and then repeat that process to add the Wife Individual data reference.
That should provide all the details you need.
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by johnhanson » 14 May 2022 22:49

Mike
Sorry gone down with a chest infection and anti-biotics seem to have knocked me for six

Yep, well aware of the difference and I have taken you suggestion onboard and configured the columns of the family tab. Already have the individual one configured and something that I hadn't thought of

Regards
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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by Jean » 23 May 2022 11:33

I am new to this so please be patient. I need help. On the diagram Individual List, the Relationship to Root column is empty. How do I get the relationships to show up. Jean

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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by tatewise » 23 May 2022 11:58

Hello Jean.
You mention the 'diagram Individual List' but I don't think you are talking about Diagram Charts.
I suspect you are talking about the Records Window and its Individuals tab columns.
One of those columns is the Relationship to Root but only works if a File Root Individual record is selected.

To set the File Root, first select the Individual record you want to be the File Root.
You can select that record in the Individuals tab of the Records Window or in the Focus Window.
Then use the Edit > File Root > Set as File Root command.

That should restore the Relationship to Root column details.

BTW: Your profile on the right of your posting says you are using Family Historian V6. Is that correct?
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry

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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by LornaCraig » 23 May 2022 12:13

Hello Jean,

To add briefly to Mike’s reply, as you have mentioned diagrams I wonder whether you are confusing a Diagram Root with a File Root. You can select any person in your file as the ‘root’ of any type of diagram so that it will display that person’s ancestors or descendants or both, or all their relatives. But what the Individuals list in the Records window displays is the relationship to the File Root. The File Root can be set as Mike has explained (you can even just right-click on them in the Focus window and choose Make File Root).
Lorna

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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by Jean » 23 May 2022 15:04

Thank you Mike and Lorna. I have Family Historian v.6.2. I will try what you suggest and get back to you with a "success"
or "need more help" lol, lol.

I have been doing this for over 25 years but haven't come across this problem before. I noticed when I clicked on the heading Relationship to Root, by mistake, the relationships disappeared. That is my problem, getting them back.

Anyway, thanks for your advice. Will let you know. Jean

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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by Jean » 23 May 2022 15:14

Hello Mike and Lorna,

"SUCCESS". Did what you said and it is all back to normal. I may not have explained myself very well, but we all got there in the end, somehow. Thank you so much. Jean

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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by LornaCraig » 23 May 2022 15:26

Jean wrote:
23 May 2022 15:04
I noticed when I clicked on the heading Relationship to Root, by mistake, the relationships disappeared. That is my problem, getting them back.
That's because when the column is sorted alphabetically any 'blank' relationships will be sorted at the beginning. It could be argued that they should be sorted at the end, but that's the way it is. The relationship will be blank for anyone who is unrelated to the root or only indirectly related. So the relationships had not disappeared, you would still have seen them if you scrolled down past all the blank ones.
Lorna

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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by Gowermick » 23 May 2022 15:54

Further to Lorna’s answer, were you aware that if you Alt-Click on a column heading (i.e. Hold down Alt key when you click), the column will sort in reverse order, from Ascending to Descending, so in your case, your blank relationships will drop to the bottom. :D
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Re: Details missing from named list

Post by Jean » 24 May 2022 12:34

Hi to you all,
I appreciate all what you are saying but all I know is the column in question was empty all the way down all the names.

Not to worry, it is all okay now, thanks to your help. If I have any more problems I know where to come, lol, lol. Jean

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