* Sentences TMG to fh

Importing from another genealogy program? This is the place to ask. Questions about Exporting should go in the Exporting sub-forum of the General Usage forum.
Post Reply
avatar
E Wilcock
Megastar
Posts: 1181
Joined: 11 Oct 2014 07:59
Family Historian: V7
Location: London
Contact:

Sentences TMG to fh

Post by E Wilcock »

DonF just posted on another thread

"You have to re-build sentences of course, but that's true of all input from TMG."

I need to put my mind to the Sentence issue and would appreciate some clarification.

In TMG one might have the following types of Sentence.

The default sentence with comes with the software for standard TMG Tag/Event.
The default sentence for each custom Tag/Event

Plus local one off customisations of both the above.

I discovered sentences in TMG and how one could edit them rather late in the day. The TMG Project I am now running in fh from a direct import does not look at first sight to need the sentences editing.

There is one custom Tag Research Notes and apart from this one which I did re-edit, there may well never have been any customised sentences.

However on another project, also without custom facts, I did in TMG massively rewrite the sentences locally to get a flowing and very full narrative for a Second Site (website) cd for a family reunion.

When I open this Project in fh, I do get the He or She "experienced" crop up quite a lot. For dated censuses that might not be a surprise. But why are they there in Occupation?

And if I re export to GEDsite using the plugin, I certainly cant reproduce the nice paragraphs I had in Second Site from TMG.

It is this tangle that has daunted me - and I have postponed thinking about it. Far easier to leave most of my work in TMG.

Could someone from fh please tell me exactly which of the TMG Sentence types listed above need re-editing and how to set about it?

And in which circumstances this re-editing will be required?
I cannot understand why I have one TMG Project that required next to no editing and where the Occupation sentence does not have the word experienced cropping up at all.
User avatar
tatewise
Megastar
Posts: 28341
Joined: 25 May 2010 11:00
Family Historian: V7
Location: Torbay, Devon, UK
Contact:

Re: Sentences TMG to fh

Post by tatewise »

The answer to your dilemma all hinges on standard GEDCOM fact tags, and Don is partly incorrect.

In both TMG and FH all those standard Gedcom fact tags are predefined with sentence templates, etc.
In TMG that is in Tools > Master Tag Type List for each tag.
In FH that is in Tools > Fact Types and Edit for each fact.
So when those GEDCOM fact tags are imported from TMG to FH they have sensible sentences predefined.
The TMG sentences templates are NOT included in the import, it is only the internal FH sentence templates that get used.

TMG also has predefined non-GEDCOM tags with sentence templates, such as Codicil, Criminal, Employment, etc.
When imported to FH those may be treated as Uncategorised Data Fields (UDF) unless the TMG GEDCOM export as is changed from 2 TYPE to 1 EVEN.
Unfortunately, TMG does not identify which are standard and which are non-GEDCOM tags.
You can also define your own custom tags and sentences in TMG.
I recommend you investigate how_to:handling_unrecognised_data_fields|> Handling Uncategorised Data Fields (UDF) to see if your Projects have any UDF.

Any tag imported to FH that is not a predefined standard GEDCOM fact will have no Tools > Fact Types definition, and thus no sentence template, so FH reverts to the X experienced Y default sentence template.

So presumably the main Project you are running in FH uses almost exclusively standard GEDCOM fact tags.
The one exception is the Research Notes fact tag that you have needed to define in FH.

The other Project, as you say, has non-GEDCOM Census 1841-1911 tags, and also other non-GEDCOM tags, and they will all need defining in FH if they say X experienced Y.
However, I would advise that those Census 1841-1911 tags are all converted to standard GEDCOM Census fact tags.
The Occupation fact tag is a different scenario.
First check the TMG Tools > Master Tag Type List for Occupation and check it exports as GEDCOM tag OCCU.
I suspect that either the definition has changed or there are two similar Occupation tag definitions.
Secondly, in FH use Tools > Fact Types, tick Show Hidden, and review the Occupation entries.
Report back here what you find in TMG and in FH so we can advise on corrective measures.

Rather than trying to list TMG tags that will need new FH definitions, it is easier to perform the import and identify the facts that say X experienced Y.
The only other suggestion is to look at Tools > Fact Types in FH and in the Fact Set: droplist top left select Standard to list only the standard GEDCOM facts. Any tag type names that you use in TMG that do not match that list will need new FH definitions.
See how_to:narrative_report_fact_sentence_templates|> Narrative Report Fact Sentence Templates.

If you use the Export Gedcom File Plugin to export to GedSite it will include all the FH sentence template definitions, and as far as I can tell from John Cardinal will offer much the same capabilities as Second Site but may be not all the features have been implemented yet. Eventually you should get something similar to Second Site.
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry
avatar
E Wilcock
Megastar
Posts: 1181
Joined: 11 Oct 2014 07:59
Family Historian: V7
Location: London
Contact:

Re: Sentences TMG to fh

Post by E Wilcock »

Mike, That is so useful. That is exactly what I need. First to understand and then look at the details.

Now I come to think of it I did indeed create a custom (one line) occupation Tag in every TMG Project to appear on my public website.
When imported to FH those may be treated as Uncategorised Data Fields (UDF) unless the TMG GEDCOM export as is changed from 2 TYPE to 1 EVEN.
This is a detail I dont quite understand. Does this apply if I havent been choosing to export a GEDCOM? My import to fh has been directly opening a TMG Project file, not selecting and using GEDCOM.

Since the UK dated census fields seem not to have been re-mapped to GEDCOM Census tags, I think it will re alot them in TMG, using the TMG Utility before import.
User avatar
tatewise
Megastar
Posts: 28341
Joined: 25 May 2010 11:00
Family Historian: V7
Location: Torbay, Devon, UK
Contact:

Re: Sentences TMG to fh

Post by tatewise »

It seems odd that you needed a custom Occupation tag in TMG because that is a predefined standard GEDCOM fact.

However, if you change the Tools > Master Tag Type List in TMG so your custom Occupation uses the OCCU tag, it will import into FH as a standard GEDCOM Occupation fact with a predefined sentence.

Similarly, make all the Census Year tags use the CENS tag the same as the standard Census tag in TMG.

Yes, the UDF problem may still apply with direct import from TMG because FH uses the GEDCOM tags defined in the Tools > Master Tag Type List and therefore importing as if in GEDCOM format.
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry
avatar
DonF
Diamond
Posts: 97
Joined: 07 Dec 2014 00:31
Family Historian: V7
Contact:

Re: Sentences TMG to fh

Post by DonF »

Firstly, my meaning in saying one needed to always modify FH sentences was not to imply there were no valid FH sentences, but to suggest the ex-TMG users would almost always want to change them to either get closer to what they had in TMG or modify them to make them more useful. Certainly I would have to spend months on this if I fully converted.

Second, the TMG Occupation tag is standard, not Custom and uses the OCCU code - I suspect she means she modified its associated Roles and or sentences.

Note also that ALL TMG tags can be set to have a GEDCOM code in one of 2 forms - either a standard code (like OCCU for Occupation) or a form of'1 TYPE, 2 EVEN xxxx where you define xxxx as you like.
User avatar
tatewise
Megastar
Posts: 28341
Joined: 25 May 2010 11:00
Family Historian: V7
Location: Torbay, Devon, UK
Contact:

Re: Sentences TMG to fh

Post by tatewise »

Firstly Don, Ok I understand your point, but would all TMG migrants want such elaborate sentences?
You gave the impression they would have no predefined sentences in FH at all.

Secondly Don, if she had used the standard Occupation (OCCU) tag the sentence in FH would have been like:
In 1900 John SMITH was a worker in London.
and that is what she implies she got in her main Project.
BUT in the other Project she says she got He or She "experienced", which implies a different 'custom' tag/fact/code, and thus no sentence definition in FH.

You last point is well made, and that is what TMG migrants must review when importing to FH.
Mike Tate ~ researching the Tate and Scott family history ~ tatewise ancestry
Post Reply