* All relatives chart

[jbrooks]

I am using an all relatives chart. 3 generations down from the root the parents of a spouse are not being displayed. Appreciate any help here.

Kind regards Jonathan.

[PeterR]

As it says in FH's Help:

The All Relatives tree shows Ancestors, Descendants, Descendants of Ancestors (e.g. cousins), and spouses of any of these.

It does not show Ancestors of Descendants' spouses.

[tatewise]

Select the spouse with missing parents and their spouse as the Diagram Root Couple.
See how_to:key_features_for_newcomers|> Key Features for Newcomers under Diagram Root Couple.
Does that display what you want?

The only other option for your original tree, is to use Diagram > Insert into Diagram > Ancestor Tree with the problem spouse as the Root Person and position that sub-tree near that spouse.

[jbrooks]

May be I am missing a trick here. I have added a marriage using AS that included a new individual as the male spouse of a daughter. In the tree the male spouse is displayed in the "all relatives diagram". Snippet below:-

charles and gladys.JPG (74.55 KiB) Viewed 10628 times

Also added using AS was the father of the added male spouse taken from the church parish records.

In the all relatives diagram I would also like to display both new additions e.g. spouse and ancestor that is the newly added father of the male spouse. snippet below is Charles as the root of all relatives:-

henry e savill.JPG (72.97 KiB) Viewed 10628 times

I have followed the suggestions, read the documentation and tried options although not getting the expected result.

[tatewise]

As I said earlier, in your original All Relatives Diagram, use Diagram > Insert into Diagram > Ancestor Tree with Charles Henry Robert SAVILL as the Root Person and left-click drag that sub-tree to his box on the original tree. With a little care you can often get them to overlap such that they look like one tree. Use right-click Order to move one tree Back/Forward so the desired box is in front.

[jbrooks]

I followed the advice I think. Included Timothy BD in AS and then added Albert Rutter as unrelated. I then added Rutter household keeping the relation to head of House hold in AS; each time I had to re-select Albert Rutter (not an issue).

Made respective notes in TBD entry and inserted into tree and saved as a chart. Snippet below:-

all desc ances chart.JPG (230 KiB) Viewed 10571 times

I do have a scenario that is slightly different. Thomas, Ellen (wife of Thomas), Gladys BD are with Ellen's father, Charles Wallis, in the 1901 census. So unlike the Rutter's scenario Ellen is a direct descendant of the head of house hold. I do hope you are not getting tiered of all my Qs. Looking for advice/suggestions on how to record this in FH/with AS.

snippet from census:-

charles wallis.JPG (50.99 KiB) Viewed 10571 times

Out of curiosity why does FH not include the option to "go down" descendant and then backup ancestors of people further down the tree?

And I like the new UI for the forum particularly when inserting files.

Kind regards Jonathan.

[tatewise]

Your latest Census example is comparatively simple.
Presumably, Thomas BD and Gladys BD are already related in your Project tree?
Add Ellen Wallis as Spouse of Thomas, and add Charles Wallis as her Father (Mother unknown).

The All Relatives Diagram omits several branch cases.
In general the Ancestor tree of a Descendant could be enormous, and if added to every Descendant would become an extremely large and complex Diagram.
I suspect you have just a few short such Ancestor trees, but the software does not attempt to cater for those special cases.
Have you tried choosing a Diagram Root further down your Descendant tree?

[jbrooks]

I have tried setting the root further down although loose other parts of the tree. I now have more than one instance of a Brooks-Dowsett in another household.

Starting a next session of editing from a chart this is good although if I start with a new "all decedents tree" for each session then the inserted tree has to be re-inserted. However, I understand that the preferred method of working is not to initiate work with saved charts (correct me here if I am wrong) but to use the tree options.

Is there a way to force the inserted tree from the all descendants tree option?

[tatewise]

Differences between Working Diagrams and Saved Charts:-

Working Diagrams will always start afresh with just the chosen type of tree for the chosen root.
i.e. All Relatives Diagram will only include one standard All Relatives tree, and Descendant Diagram will only include one Descendant tree.

Saved Charts will remember the original tree and all inserted trees, and remember their tree roots, and remember any inserted text boxes, lines, pictures, options, etc.
i.e. It will remember an All Relatives tree for say John DOWSETT, and an inserted Ancestor tree for say Charles SAVILL, with whatever other customisation has been applied.
This is the technique to use to 'force' whatever tree combinations you need. You can have as many Saved Charts as you like.
However, Saved Charts are not 'frozen' and will update with any new facts and any new relatives added to their trees.
A side effect is the trees/boxes may change in size and position, so any inserted trees may have to be repositioned to align them with other trees.

[jbrooks]

thank you.

[jbrooks]

I have another example where a direct male descendant marries, the male descendant dies. His widow then remarries although is not displayed on the tree when added. I am assuming because she is not a direct descendant; is that correct?

She then divorces the second husband and marries a third. Second and third husband not shown in the tree; assuming as not direct descendants.

Existing individual data is updated when editing saved charts although new people are not added to the chart.

I know it is not an option although would it be considered to display in an "all persons chart" non descendant relative(s) is say a flag was set?

[tatewise]

You are correct about the Descendants section only showing direct blood-line descendants of the Diagram Root.

Try choosing a Diagram Root couple from among the current Descendants, so that the multi-marriage family you mention is in the Ancestral section of the tree. That family does not have to be direct ancestors of the Diagram Root as long as they are related by blood or marriage. The ancestors of the 'other' spouses will not be shown, but the multiple marriages, and descendants thereof, should be included.

I believe that new people will be added to a saved Chart, providing they would have been included in a similar Diagram with the same Options. You may have to adjust the number of Generations in the Options if those new people are added to the earliest or latest generation in the Chart. Or you may need to click the Expansion Buttons where they join existing people of tree in the Chart.

You can add your Vote to Wish List Ref 501 Entire Pool Diagram which is another way of defining ALL relatives including by marriage.

[jbrooks]

Voted and will try suggestions when I next add a new person to chart.

In the mean time I have entered the 3 husbands with a view to insert them in, which I have done. The 3 marriage events were entered to the wife initially but these events are not shown on the chart after adding. I moved marriage event of the second husband to his record. No change.

Currently first husbands marriage event displayed with the wife.

Simpy put I would like the 3 marriage events shown with the wife or the individual husbands or a mix e.g. would like the 3 events displayed. Current view is below:-

3 husbands.JPG (49.22 KiB) Viewed 10267 times

[tatewise]

Please post a screenshot of the Property Box of the Wife showing the Main tab including the Spouse tabs near the bottom to confirm she is partnered with the 3 Husband's.

Try creating a Diagram where the Diagram Root is a Descendant of the Wife or her Husbands.

[jbrooks]

Is this what you are looking for Mike:-

3 husbands property box.JPG (84.68 KiB) Viewed 10235 times

[tatewise]

Yes, that is OK, thank you.

Try creating a Diagram with the Diagram Root being a Descendant of the Wife or her Husbands.
Then all three Husbands should be listed against the Wife.

For all three Marriages to be listed in Wife box depends on the Text Scheme.
Please post the edit box Expression for the Marriage item.
It should use the [1+] looping index to display all instances of Marriage Event.

Also there are options to display the Marriage Event in both Wife and Husband box.

[jbrooks]

Hi Mike,

Tried the descendant tree and result posted below. It does show hubbys and also duplicates the descendants that gets a little busy on the chart.

I have cut some areas of the tree as there are two descendants (one knows most and the other probably not looking) although I have to respect their data.

You implied that the depth could be modified and that would probably fix the ancestors of wife (28 individuals). Although wife's box still shown. I would like to explore the expressions as this has worked really well before. However, that will be another post as more than three attachments.

3 husbands insert desc tree.JPG (101.48 KiB) Viewed 10224 times

[jbrooks]

Mike here are my current tree text functions and the first picture is the edit box. These I cloned before modifying other parts of the test scheme (not the all events schema). These look like "nested" text schemes and have not looked at these before with regard to how to create/modify. Any tips appreciated as they do offer layout options that are potentially useful in charts.

Edit box:-

mar txt sch view.JPG (29.92 KiB) Viewed 10220 times

I did try the [1+] and could not get the desired result.

Appreciate your help with this.

[tatewise]

Thank you for those postings, but it is getting late, so I will study them tomorrow.

[tatewise]

To include all the Marriage Events in the Wife box needs a change to the Text Scheme.
For family events such as Marriage and Divorce the default items use the CUR~FAMS contextual shortcut, which refers to each Current Family couple displayed in the Diagram/Chart, and does not allow the looping [1+] index.
So for each of the 4 Marriage items shown in your screenshot, use Edit and replace every CUR~FAMS with INDI.FAMS[1+] taking care to retain the preceeding % and succeeding > in each case.
That will loop through all Family as Spouse Marriages where required, but in most boxes will show the same single Marriage as it did before.

In such multiple Marriage cases it would be good to show the Spouse Name for each Marriage.
So move Spouse Name if 'One Box Per Marriage' item up below Marriage item and Edit as follows:
Template: =ExistsText(%INDI.FAMS[2]>MARR%,"Spouse: " . %INDI.FAMS[1+]>~SPOU>NAME:FULL%)
( %INDI.FAMS[2]>MARR% ensures the names are only shown when 2 or more Marriages. )
Description: Spouse Name
Tick Start on New Line and Group with previous line
Ensure the Box Type and Conditions are set the same as the other Marriage items.

The only way to get all three Husband boxes included in an All Relatives Diagram is if the Diagram Root is a descendant of the Wife.

Otherwise, the missing Husband boxes can be added by using Diagram > Insert into Diagram > Descendant Tree, select the Wife and set Generations Down to 1.
To hide the coloured ribbons, right-click Wife and choose Format and tick Prevent Linking as Duplicate.
To hide the 1st Husband, right-click him and choose Hide.
Right-click the Wife and choose Order > Send to Back to move behind main Diagram.
Now you can select and drag the 2nd/3rd Husbands so they on the right of the original Wife.

The resulting boxes should look like this:

Wife and 3 Husbands.png (23.65 KiB) Viewed 10184 times

[jbrooks]

Perfect Mike; screen shot below.

Kind regards Jonathan.

3 husbands insert done.JPG (94.17 KiB) Viewed 10157 times